Belen, Aminah, Mahogany, Zakeyyah -- use this space to begin your discussion of Divergent. You are responsible for reading the first 10 pages, asking a good Level 4 question, and answering it in CCEJ. You may also add on (new evidence) or disagree with another group member's post.
Masai Lewis
ReplyDeleteWhy does the author start the book off in the past but then starts the second chapter in the present?
The author starts in the past so that we can we get a little preview as to where she is coming from or see a little bit of what caused now. In the text it says that she is "sleep in a gymnasium " then in the second chapter she miraculously jumps to a bedroom with a pillow and sheets. So based on the complete scenery change, I think the author purposely put the first chapter in the past then the second one in the future, because it would show that her living conditions absolutely changed from in a gymnasium to a nice a bed.
I believe that the author begins the book in the past because he wants the readers to get a clear understanding about whats happening and whats going on in the setting because it could get confusing if the author would have jumped right into the present about the book but he wanted people to have a clear understanding about the book. He wanted to let the readers know what was the actual setting and how the women were being treated and the specific things that they had to do in that lifestyle so it could lead us through the problems that are occuring in the book. - Alliyah Mccollough
DeleteMasai Lewis
ReplyDeleteWhy do you think that the room has windows that cannot open all the way?
I think that the windows that are in the room are not able to be broken or opened all the way because the people that run the house know that the handmaids or the Marthas or the Wives would most definitely try to run away. In the text it says that "the window does not open and the window pane is shatterproof". This quote shows that the people who created the room wanted to make sure that the people in the room does not escape or attempt to leave the room.
To respond to Masai's first question, I think the reason why its starts off in the past in the beginning and then shifts to the present is to show the changes that have happened to the main character. For example in the first chapter Offred talks about how the Handmaids "yearned for a future" and wanted to escape from being used as sex objects and then disposed when the men of status are done with them. And, in the present Offred seems to have forgottten about all of that. She now seems to be tolerate or comfortable with where she is and what holds for her now in the present than in the future.
ReplyDeleteQuestion: Why do you think Offred feels comfortable showing herself to the guards and why does she try to entertain them?
ReplyDeleteI think now she doesn't care that much anymore. In the book we realize that she use to have a husband and a child, but now she used by the men in her dystopia as a sex object. But I think that they use the Handmaids to be fertilizers for their babies that they take away from them because their wives can't have children, since they are now in old age.
I believe that Offtred was comfortable showing herself to the guards because she was tired of being confined inside of that place where she had no freedom and she just had to let go. When she soon noticed that she once had a husband and children she knew that she had once had a regular life. And she wanted to entertain the guard because she knew that she couldnt have children so she had to do everything that could have a substitute for that.
DeleteHow does this story fit the characteristics of a dystopian world?
ReplyDeleteThis story "The Handmaid's Tale" fits the characteristics of a dystopian world because of the fact the people's freedom is restricted. There freedom is restricted because of the fact they aren't able to do whatever they want. In the text, we learn that the people are limited to very little stuff and in fact is watched by guards. In the text, it states, "we weren't allowed out, except for our walks, twice daily, two by two around the football field, which was enclosed now by a chain-link fence topped with barbed wire" (Artwood 4). From this quote, it proves how the main character Offred and everyone's else freedom is limited/ restricted because they can't do as pleased. If their freedom wasn't restricted, then they'll be able to do what they and when. If they were able to do what they want, then they'll be free. Due to the fact that the people aren't able to what they want and live under a way of life is what proves how this story fit the characteristic of dystopian world where freedom is restricted.
So far, what is the motif of the story and what could it represent?
ReplyDeleteSo far there are a couple of motifs in the story, but the one that stands out the most to me is the color red. The word "red" appears several times in the story whereas it is used to describe a lot of things throughout the story. In the text, the author uses the color red to describe "red-gloved hands...red hexagon... red [umbrella]" (Artwood 9-11). From this quote it proves how the word red is used to describe almost every thing. With that, the color red can probably represent the status of the people because of the fact we do learn that women are separated from men. The women must wear the red in order to disguise themselves. Therefore, a motif of this story is the color red in which can represent the status of the women.
When Aunt Lydia says "There is more than one kind of freedom... Freedom to and freedom from. In the days of anarchy, it was freedom to. Now you are being given freedom from. Don't underrate it" (Artwood 24), what does she mean by that?
ReplyDeleteWhen Aunt Lydia says this quote, what she means by it is, freedom before was by choice, now freedom is given from the commander/(higher position). Back then, people were able to do what they want and when they wanted, but now due to a new law, freedom is no longer a choice but instead is given. All of this howeveris due to protect women. In the text, it states, "Women were not protected then... Now we walk along the same streets, in red pairs, and no man..."(Artwood 24). From this quote, it proves that women aren't given freedom by choice because of the fact, the law/ way of life is there to protect them. Freedom is now given from the law in which the women must follow in order to continue on in life.
When Lydia says that quote i think that she means that there is not only one way that the women can be free from that restriction that they are on. And it is not only one way that they could have helped themselves. Aunt Lydia beleives that because the women no longer have a say in what they do now and what they could do with their bodies because the women cant even have babies in their bodies because that is one of the restrictions that the women have to obey But because she wants to protect the women but she is trying to help them so that they could be free and get out of that and there are many ways that they could have done that.
DeleteBelen Campos
ReplyDeleteI agree with Aminah in her explanation of one way this story fits into the characteristics of a dystopian world. Also this novel exemplifies a dystopian world because of citizens having to conform to uniform expectations and individuality and dissent being bad. In the novel the narrator states, “A bed. Single, mattress medium-hard, covered with a flocked white spread. Nothing takes place in the bed but sleep; or no sleep. I try not to think too much. Like other things now, thought must be rationed” (Atwood 8). The narrator describes their night scenery as a room with one simple element in it where they are not allowed to explore their own minds. The narrator shows how on top of having a limited area to sleep in which they have to conform to they also are not able to think without consequences. They are limited to their own thoughts therefore limited to their individuality. This novel takes place in an dystopian world because the narrator has had to adapt to a simple room and they aren’t allowed to think their own thoughts.
Belen Campos
ReplyDeleteHow does diction lead to the development of the mood in the first chapter?
The author uses words such as “yearned, future, insatiability, tried, army-issue, rows, not, children” (Atwood 4) to develop the mood of a strict undesirable environment. The author starts the novel off by describing the scenery and allowing the narrator to express some of her feelings. She uses diction to create a mood of not ever wanting to be in her shoes. She creates suspense through the description of the restrictions she had in her environment. She seems like she doesn’t want to be there but has no other choice. Moreover she tries to hint at the way she is living but stops herself as though she was not able to talk anymore. Overall the author develops a suspenseful mood which seems undesirable through the narrator.
Based on what we read so far, do you think the world the main chatacter used to live in was controlled and now got worse or do you think they were given fredom?
ReplyDeleteI think the society in which the main character lived before, they were granted freedom but soon it turned controlling, because before woman embraced their appearances and sexuality, but that has changed. For example in the book the main character talks about how she went to go spend time with her mother and saw people burning magazines with women exposing their bodies on the cover: "The woman handed me one of the magazines. It had a pretty woman on it, with no clothes on… she said to me, toss it in, quick" (39). This shows how the main charcater's environment was taking a turning point because now the image of women's bodies wasn't fully being accepted, and now the main character see how everything has changed thus far. So therefore the society in which she lived was actually being controlling, and not embracing what it meant to be a woman.
Why do you think that the authority leaders that run the city decided to actually put a wall of criminals in the city publicly and why even have a wall in the first place?
ReplyDeleteI believe that the authority leaders of " The Republic of Gilead" actually decided to create that type of wall is to create fear for everyone else in the community. I say this because that wall is full of dead people that has committed some type of crime in the community and had to die for their crime. In the text it says, " All of these men have a sign on their neck". This quote is saying that the men who committed the crime had a picture of a child on the sign. This is saying that what ever you do to be hung on the wall, they put a picture on the sign signifying exactly what you have done. That creates fear for everyone else in the community which is why they decided to create the wall.
I also agree with both Aminah and Alliyah when they refer to Aunt Lydia's quote of "freedom to and freedom from". I think that Aunt Lydia also means that even though now the Handmaids might feel that they are being controlled and ruled over, they still have freedom. To them freedom might mean free from captivism or free will, but i think Aunt Lydia is trying to tell them that they are given freedom by their rulers and they are given the freedom to do as they wish with that freedom in which they are given.
ReplyDeleteIn the story, we learn that the lady Serena Joy is the one who enforced women stay in. With that, why do you she pushed to enforce that happen?
ReplyDeleteSerena Joy enforced that women stay in the house so that they can stay protected. I think Serena was only trying to be a protector of the women society and with that, she pushed things too far to the point where "someone tried to shoot her". Protection is something every women wanted, but having their children and husband taken away from them wasnt worth it. In the text, it mentions how Serena Joy was telling speeches and making sacrifices. As stated in the text, "Her speeches were about sanctity of the home, about how women should stay home...she was making for the good of all. From this quote, it is saying how Serena Joy was only doing all this to create a better society and for the good of all. However, things didn't go so well because it only turned out as a prison for women where they aren't able to do what they want when they want. Therefore with that, I believe SerenanJoy only enforced this all be done in order to help women and for the good of it.
Why does Offred and Ofglen kind of hesitate to say anything to the reporters that approached them while they were walking down the street?
ReplyDeleteI believe that both Offred and Ofglen were a bit hesitant to speak to the reporters that approached them because they did not know 100% whether or not those were actually reporters or not. This said because there are people in this community called " Eyes" who are people that try to tempt Marthas and Wives to do things that are against the rules. For example in the text Offred says, " I look over at Ofglen and see she is quiet, they might actually be eyes not reporters"(44).. This quote shows the uncertainty that exists between both offred and ofglen, but to make sure she does not get in trouble she answers their question.
I believe the two women hesitate to speak to the men because of the punishment that would be done to them. In this society, women aren't allowed to speak or turn men on, and if so there would be a punishment given, possibly being hung. In the text, while on there way to the supermarket, they see bodies being hung by the wall in which they question there reasoning from being there. As stated in the text, it states, "We... stand and look st the bodied. It doesn't matter if we look...they'll be there gor days, until there's a new batch, so as many people as possible will have the chance to see" (Atwood 32). From this quote, it proves how society are willing to kill those who are unwilling to follow the rules. With women trying to speak out to men is a rule being broken, and in results can end up like the dead bodies. Therefore, the two women hesitate to speak to the men because of the fact they are afraid they could end up like the bodies if fail to follow the rules.
DeleteHow are women valued in society?
ReplyDeleteWomen I believe are higly valued in society only when they are pregnant. This is so because when a women is pregnant, they are considered the lucky one and gives other women hope. In the text, women aren't just able to easily get pregnant which is why when someone name "Ofwayne" or "Ofwarren" walks into the supermarket, all eyes are on her. As stated in the text "One of them is vastly pregnant...She's magic presence to us, an object of envy and desire, we covet her. Shes a flag of on a hilltop showing us what can still be done: we too can be saved" (Atwood 26). From this quote, it is proving how pregnant women or looked as by or her women. With that, non-pregnant women tends to value those who at pregnant due to the fact it gives them hope and value the women around them. Therefore, women in this society are valued by other women when pregnant because of the hope and faith it gives them about life: showing the women that, them too, can be saved.
Belen Campos
ReplyDeleteHow can superiority be exemplified in the text?
Throughout the entire text the reader is given a surplus amount of examples of something or someone who is worshipped. That is another characteristic of a dystopian society. In the text it states, “So, you’re the new one, she said. She didn’t step aside to let me in, she just stood there in the doorway, blocking the entrance. She wanted me to feel that I could not come into the house unless she said so. There is a push and shove, these days, over such toeholds” (13). The Commander’s Wife is the superior power in this relationship. She makes up the rules which both will follow. In this relationship the narrator has no other option but to listen and follow every direction the other lady had. To add on and to answer Aminah’s question, I think women have an important role in the novel’s society because as shown in this example and in the simple fact that the main roles are taken by the women such as the Wives women in power hold high positions. Women show superiority through the roles they hold such as the Commander’s Wife over the narrator.
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ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteBelen Campos
ReplyDeleteHow do characters in the novel compare to our society today?
In the novel the author merges activities or traditions of present day. He uses the sensitivity of a woman through the Wives in the text. They each have their own garden. The author states, “Many of the Wives have such gardens, it’s something for them to order and maintain and care for” (12). She explains how women take care of and manage gardens which is girl like. The Commander’s Wife is said to have to largest of all the gardens. In society today gardening is envisioned as a job for a female because of the flowers involved. Also the simple act of taking care of and showing appreciation for something is sensed more in women because of their sensitivity. Women in the novel are as women are nowadays because of their affection.
MAHOGANY:
DeleteMahogany
To answer Belen question there are some ways in which the characters in the Handmaids society is similar to the people we interact with day to day in our society. To me with how the Handmaids are so covered and less exposed they seem to remind me of nuns or pious people who are covered up seem to be isolated from the real world. To me the Handmaids in our book seem to be living in a world in which only their kind is accepted. That is the same way in which people such as priests, nuns and missionaries seem to view themselves. In their beliefs and customs their kind is only accepted. But some of the characteristics or personalties of the characters do relate to us because, I'm sure we have some aspects of Offred in ourselves in which we may feel lost like she is, or different, or feel like we are captive and that we don't fit into society
Belen Campos
ReplyDeleteHow is religion hinted at in the beginning of the story?
In the text the author describes a war in which Baptist are part of. There is a war among religions. Each religion is regarded as the enemy for the other. In the passage it states, “We’ve been sent good weather… They’ve defeated more of the rebels, since yesterday… Baptists. They had stronghold in the Blue Hills. They smoked them out” (20). To the handmaid the fact that Baptist has been defeated was good news. If one is at war then having defeated the other is a good thing. If the others in the war are being defeated then it will be easier for one to win. If one wins then one gets to make up the rules. Overall the novel talks about the war among religions.
What is the significance of this quote?
ReplyDelete"The snakes and the sword are bits of broken symbolism left over from the time before" (Atwood 60).
The significance of this quote is that it identifies something from the pass in which can connect back to freedom. Throughout the story, it constantly talks about the present and how they are living in such a new life style they're not 100% use to. In the story, the author identifies a snake and sword in which is considered as a symbol from the pass. As stated, it states, "The snakes and the sword are bits of broken symbolism left over from the time before" (Atwood 60). From this quote, it is proving how the snake and sword had such strong meaning due to the fact it was something from the past. The past is what gave people freedom and a life to live. But now that the people live in a dystopian world, freedom is no longer an option which is why this quote is so significant.
Why do you think birthing a child is wanted in this dystopian society?
ReplyDeleteI believe birthing a child in this dystopian society is so important due to the fact it is what keep the women alive. Every women in society wants to be pregnant so bad, to the fact they envy those who are pregnant because they want to be pregnant too. In the story, when the women is asked by the doctor does she wants a baby, she responds by saying yes. However with that, in the back of head she was thinking, "Give me children, or else I die" (Atwood 61). From this quote, it proves the woman is only willing to have a child in order to save her life. If she doesn't have a baby, then dying is her choice. Therefore with that, women in this dystopian world find it so important to have a child because of the fact it is what keeps them alive.
How do you think offred feels about having sex with the head of the house?
ReplyDeleteI think that she actually thinks that having sex with the head of the household is just a part of her job and she does not have a type of relationship nor connection with the guy. In the book it shows that the lady holding her actually seemed like she was feeling more of a connection then offred herself. Honestly I think offred is just happy that the guy she's having sex with does not stink and looks better than the last guy. In the text it states, " at least he's an improvement on the previous one who smelled like a church cloakroom in the rain"(95). This shows that the offred actually was grateful that the guy she was having sex with smell better than the previous one she also mentioned in the book that he was better looking than the last. Knowing all of this shows readers that this is straight business and she has no type of connection to the owner of the house.
Who is luke and why does offred keep reminising about him?
ReplyDeleteI believe that luke is her husband.I say this because earlier in the book she talked about how she and Luke took care of their child and had a great time doing it before she joined this group. She keeps thinking about him and reminiscing about him because I think being this new society is making her and miss the old days she had with her husband and her child. In the text it states,"lying in bed with Luke his hand on my round belly. The three of us she's kicking turning over within me"(103). in this quote it is clear that offred is having a flashback to when she was laying in bed with Luke and pregnant with her child. This is one of many flashbacks that she has of luke and on that note shows us readers that she misses her husband Luke and wants to go back to see him or be with him.
Do you think that serena joy likes offred or dislikes offred?
ReplyDeleteI think that after reading a lot of the book it is very clear that Serena joy absolutely does not like offred. this is sad because when reading the book you can see by the little things she says to offred and the little things that Serena joy does to her which shows us readers that she is not really fond offred. In the book there is a clear look as to why I think serena joy does not like offred. The book says," there is loading in her voice as if the touch of my flesh sickens and contaminates her"(95). This quote is a prime example as to why I think that serena joy does not like her. while the head of the house is having sex with offred Serena joy is holding of red down. Then when the master is the is done serena joy is mad at offred and it makes her angry that she had to hold offred through the sex.
AMINAH:
ReplyDeleteHow do you think the wife feel about other women having sexual intercourse with her husband
I believe the wife feels uncomfortable and jealous about other women having sex with her husband. I believe the wife feels this way due to the fact on how she treats Offred after her husband's and Offred's sexual intercourse. Once the two were done having sex, the wife immediately kicked Offred out the room, whereas Offred was suppose to rest for a while before leaving. In the text, Serene Joy says " 'You can get up now.. get up and out.' She's supposed to have me rest, for ten minutes..." (Atwood 95). From this quote it proves Serena Joy's response to Offred after the sexual intercourse in which was rude. Therefore, due to Serena Joy's response, it show how she uncomfortable and jealous about the whole situation which is why she responded the way she did. If she haven't resounded that way, it would of shows she was ok with it. if Serena was ok with the intercourse, then she wouldn't have kicked Offred out the way she did,
AMINAH:
ReplyDeleteDo you think Offred enjoy having sex with the commander?
I believe Offred enjoys having sex with the commanders due to the fact that she had signed up for it. In this society, sex is forbidden among the handmaids unless it is with an commander which is why I think she enjoys it. As stated in the text, Offred states "Nothing is going on here that I haven't signed up for. There wasn't a lot of choice but there was some, and this is what I chose" (Atwood 94). From this quote, it proves how Offred has signed up to have sexual intercourse. Having sex with the commander is something Offred probably enjoys because of the fact she's no longer able to do it with her husband or ex-husband. Therefore, due to how society is set up, Offred has no other chose of having sex, only with the commander which is why I believe she enjoys it. If Offred didn't enjoy having sex, the shen wouldn't have signed up for it. If she didn't sign up for it, then she wouldn't be able to get pregnant which is something she wanted from the beginning of the story.
AMINAH:
ReplyDeleteDo you think Offred accepts who she has become and who she is at this point?
I don't believe Offred has accepted who she is yet due to the fact that she constantly brings up old memories. So far in the story, we learned that Offred was married and had a child, and also had a different name. in the text, she mentions that Offred wasn't her real name and how some day she'll be called her old name again. In the text, it states "I have another name, which nobody uses now because it's forbidden... I'll keep the knowledge of this name like something hidden, some treasure I'l come back to dig up" (Atwood 84). From this quote, it proves how Offred hasn't accepted the person nor name of who she is. She wishes some day to go back to her old life and be called the name she was once called. Therefore, with that being said, Offred doesn't accept who she is at this point. If Offred accepted herself, then she would accept her name and look at life as being changed for the better. However, because Offred doesn't she does;t accept the person she has become die to society.
What is the significance of the quote "We are containers, it's only the inside of our bodies that are important"?
ReplyDeleteIn the novel, specifically in chapter 16, the narrator describes how she is being used in a sexual intercourse she is having with the Commander. She describes how she decided to be part of that unhappiness. As stated in the quote their mind is set to the idea that women are supposed to give birth to babies and not serve for any bigger purpose. The women aren't supposed to catch anyone's attention neither. Women were meant to carry the babies inside them and that's why in the quote it states that only the inside of them was important. The quote is a simile in which the space available within the stomach of a woman is compared to a container. Both a belly and a container can be filled as well.
What extremes do the Handmaids have to reach because of the societies beliefs in order to feel attractive?
ReplyDeleteIn the novel the narrator explains one of the extremes through the usage of the butter on her face. She describes how she has to sneak out butter from the kitchen within her shoe in order to be able to bring it back to her room and place it on her face. In the text it states, "The better is greasy and it will go rancid and I will smell like an old cheese; but at least it’s organic, as they used to say. To such devices have we descended"(97). Since they aren't allowed to seek the mens attention they aren't allowed to fix or adjust their appearance by adding anything to it. When the narrator visited Rachel and Leah Center and that's where she got the idea of adding butter to her face. It makes her feel about herself. In the novel the women have to adjust to the circumstances that don't allow them to make theirselves feel pretty. In reality that's what makes a female a female: beauty. They are taking from that right.
How do you think offred feels about having sex with the head of the house? (Masai's Question)
ReplyDeleteTo add on to Masai's comment, I think the whole idea of having sex with the Commander is a big deal for the narrator because of the ritual behind the act. She explains how her feelings were neutral while the action was taking place because it was more of job rather than for pleasure. She states, "There wasn’t a lot of choice but there was some, and this is what I chose” (94). She chose to take the job, which would possibly lead her to having a baby. The fact that she was being fucked by the Commander meant a lot to her. She had no actual feelings for him nor did he express any for her as shown through his immediate departure after he ejaculated inside her but the possibility of reproducing makes her interested in the job she has taken. Therefore overall her feelings are more leaning towards the action and the impacts of it rather than who she is having intercourse with. The Commander is simply a device to give her possibilities of being a mother.
Why do you think Offred think that without the Commander being in charged, their dystopia will fail?
ReplyDeleteWell according to the book so far the Commander has served as a figurehead of the dystopia. I honestly think that as much as these women want to be free and escape from being captive for so long, they still are looking for guidance, and they think the only person who can give them that guidance will be him. I also think that the Commander has the utmost power amongst all of the people in the dystopia and without him keeping everything in order and contained the dystopia will fail. For example in the book it states, "if he were to falter , fail, or die, what would become of us"(88). They are scared that without the Commander everything will go back to the way it was, which was no regarding rules and structure.
To answer Belen's question I think by the quote, "We are containers, it's only the inside of our bodies that are important"? means that, the women feel that since their duties in the dystopia is to only have kids, that's basically the only thing they're good for. And also the woman being containers have been a repeated theme within this text especially when Offred talks about her failing at her job of conceiving a baby. I think these woman also see themselves as just babymakers instead of real women who are suppose to have feelings, ambition, goals, and values. For example in the text it also states, " Each month I watch for blood, fearfully , for when it comes it means failure. I have failed once again to fulfill the expectations of others, which have become my own"(73). The expectation for her is to become pregnant and conceive like all the other woman. But even though Offred has a hard time conceiving, she still is just an container since her body is being used to such measures.
ReplyDeleteTo answer Aminah's question I don't think that Offred has fully accepted what she has become but has gotten comfortable. If she fully accepted what she has beocme she wouldn't be reminscing of her old life with her husband Luke, and the exposure she had before. For example there was a point in the book when Offred talks about how she remembers seeing her mother and the rest of the people she new burning books and magazines with the appearances of woman exposing their bodies. After that moment it transitions into her describing her life as a Handmaid, and how now she is more covered-up and conservative. But this moment of her realizing that she as a woman should be covered-up shows how use she is to the expectation if women in her dystopia. So therefore she doesn't fully accept it but she 's comfortable with where she is as a person because now this is all she knows.
ReplyDelete